Author Topic: Virtual Holiday: Then, Now, Forever  (Read 4527 times)

Online dilbert505

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Re: Virtual Holiday: Then, Now, Forever
« Reply #75 on: December 27, 2019, 10:14:55 AM »
That's correct. Lacey gets to do everything on the card against anyone who is a Superstar.

Can I disagree?  Let me explain.


LACEY EVANS
Starting Hand Size: 5     Superstar Value: 1
Superstar Ability: You may pack cards as if you are a Diva, but you do not count as a Diva. Your cards with 'diva', 'woman' or 'female' in the text or title are considered to have 'lady' in the title. During each of your turns, you may overturn 2 cards to put 1 card with 'lady' in the title removed from the game into your hand.


Everyone Wants to Watch Women Wrestle
Action
Can only be packed by a Female Superstar.
When your opponent is a Male Superstar, search his Arsenal for 3 non-unique Maneuver cards, remove them from the game, and he shuffles his Arsenal.
When your opponent is a Female Superstar, this card is -1F, discard this card and your opponent discards 1 card.
Raw logo
F: 1      D: 0

Everyone Wants to Watch Women, Period
Action
Can only be packed by a Female Superstar.
When your opponent is a Male Superstar, he discards 3 cards.
When your opponent is a Female Superstar, this card is -1F, discard this card and draw 1 card.
SmackDown! logo
F: 1      D: 0


I don't want to be pedantic (ok, I do; I like to), however, my understanding is that "woman" and "women" are not the same word.
If it was intended to interact that way, an emergency errata may be needed.

You may disagree, but you're wrong. Or, rather, you're missing something very important.

LACEY EVANS
Starting Hand Size: 5     Superstar Value: 1
Superstar Ability: You may pack cards as if you are a Diva, but you do not count as a Diva. Your cards with 'diva', 'woman' or 'female' in the text or title are considered to have 'lady' in the title. During each of your turns, you may overturn 2 cards to put 1 card with 'lady' in the title removed from the game into your hand.

These cards don't gain 'lady' because of their title; they both have the word 'female' in the text.
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Offline rachelmon

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Re: Virtual Holiday: Then, Now, Forever
« Reply #76 on: December 28, 2019, 05:20:03 PM »
Classic Distraction
Reversal: non-Unique Maneuver
Can only be played by a Tag Team, Stable, when you have an Enforcer revealed, or when you have a WWF Manager in your Ring or Ringside.
F: 20     D: 0     Unique     WWF logo

Just check if this card still can be packed by any superstar.
As I would still be able to overturn it to reverse non-unique maneuver from arsenal.


Offline Eric RD

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Re: Virtual Holiday: Then, Now, Forever
« Reply #77 on: December 28, 2019, 05:30:24 PM »
Classic Distraction
Reversal: non-Unique Maneuver
Can only be played by a Tag Team, Stable, when you have an Enforcer revealed, or when you have a WWF Manager in your Ring or Ringside.
F: 20     D: 0     Unique     WWF logo

Just check if this card still can be packed by any superstar.
As I would still be able to overturn it to reverse non-unique maneuver from arsenal.

You got it.
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Offline Naitchng

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Re: Virtual Holiday: Then, Now, Forever
« Reply #78 on: January 10, 2020, 09:23:37 PM »
By the way is louiseville lip permanent? Card print permanent but tco strategy guide is not permanent. Please advice which is correct.

Offline DebuRaito

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Re: Virtual Holiday: Then, Now, Forever
« Reply #79 on: January 13, 2020, 08:50:38 PM »
By the way is louiseville lip permanent? Card print permanent but tco strategy guide is not permanent. Please advice which is correct.

Would like to get an official confirmation on this too.

Offline Eric RD

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Re: Virtual Holiday: Then, Now, Forever
« Reply #80 on: January 14, 2020, 02:44:50 AM »
Superstar guide is the correct answer. Image will be updated to reflect this come revisions.
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Offline Naitchng

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Re: Virtual Holiday: Then, Now, Forever
« Reply #81 on: January 14, 2020, 03:40:46 AM »
Superstar guide is the correct answer. Image will be updated to reflect this come revisions.

Woah den cornette is even lousier den he already is.
Not perm, can flip, can blank & such a big cost to ace when he has no drawing power🤔.
An ability tat contradicts itself for goin chain & nthin to negate oswm tb🤔. Guess going heat stall is probably the only viable way & just concede when yr opponent plays oswm tb👍
« Last Edit: January 14, 2020, 04:31:19 AM by Naitchng »

Offline Scotty

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Re: Virtual Holiday: Then, Now, Forever
« Reply #82 on: January 14, 2020, 05:37:42 AM »
Superstar guide is the correct answer. Image will be updated to reflect this come revisions.

Woah den cornette is even lousier den he already is.
Not perm, can flip, can blank & such a big cost to ace when he has no drawing power🤔.
An ability tat contradicts itself for goin chain & nthin to negate oswm tb🤔. Guess going heat stall is probably the only viable way & just concede when yr opponent plays oswm tb👍

Or choose Midnight Express and don’t worry about any of that. Options, my friend.

Offline Eric RD

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Re: Virtual Holiday: Then, Now, Forever
« Reply #83 on: January 14, 2020, 07:50:20 AM »
Superstar guide is the correct answer. Image will be updated to reflect this come revisions.

Woah den cornette is even lousier den he already is.
Not perm, can flip, can blank & such a big cost to ace when he has no drawing power🤔.
An ability tat contradicts itself for goin chain & nthin to negate oswm tb🤔. Guess going heat stall is probably the only viable way & just concede when yr opponent plays oswm tb👍

Cornette has been testing by various people playing various ways. There are methods to flip cards back over, unblank it and so on. Lots of decks do poorly against OSWM as well, doesn't mean he is a lousy Superstar.
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Offline Naitchng

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Re: Virtual Holiday: Then, Now, Forever
« Reply #84 on: January 14, 2020, 05:40:12 PM »
Superstar guide is the correct answer. Image will be updated to reflect this come revisions.

Woah den cornette is even lousier den he already is.
Not perm, can flip, can blank & such a big cost to ace when he has no drawing power🤔.
An ability tat contradicts itself for goin chain & nthin to negate oswm tb🤔. Guess going heat stall is probably the only viable way & just concede when yr opponent plays oswm tb👍

Cornette has been testing by various people playing various ways. There are methods to flip cards back over, unblank it and so on. Lots of decks do poorly against OSWM as well, doesn't mean he is a lousy Superstar.

Lols every thing u said i already knew. I did formed him both aggro & stall, the conclusion is still heat stall is the best without much use of louiseville lips. If u have to count on unblankin, flipping & putting louiseville back into yr ring. Honestly it's really a waste of time & personally the cost is too high for a ss with low drawing power & becos u are going chain, discard 2 every turn for chain action search via chain trait is already keepin yr hand tiny. Sure goin technical with bbd tb/ icbrtr can help, but cage match shuts u down.
Worst case is the contracting ability tat allows opp to overturn two when hand is 4-, which means hand deduction strategy which is bread & butter of all chain decks is not gonna work thus oso meaning yr impt actions tat counts may nv hit the ring.


Ok, u guys probably won't care what i say/feedback anyway, so yup. Btw lacey win requirements is kind of unattainable since by default u nd at least 38 turns. & most stall decks dun even go 38 turns. #howmanytimesdiduseentherevised12roundsbeenactivated?
« Last Edit: January 14, 2020, 06:51:56 PM by Naitchng »

Offline Hogtrail

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Re: Virtual Holiday: Then, Now, Forever
« Reply #85 on: January 14, 2020, 07:34:49 PM »
Superstar guide is the correct answer. Image will be updated to reflect this come revisions.

Woah den cornette is even lousier den he already is.
Not perm, can flip, can blank & such a big cost to ace when he has no drawing power🤔.
An ability tat contradicts itself for goin chain & nthin to negate oswm tb🤔. Guess going heat stall is probably the only viable way & just concede when yr opponent plays oswm tb👍

Cornette has been testing by various people playing various ways. There are methods to flip cards back over, unblank it and so on. Lots of decks do poorly against OSWM as well, doesn't mean he is a lousy Superstar.

Lols every thing u said i already knew. I did formed him both aggro & stall, the conclusion is still heat stall is the best without much use of louiseville lips. If u have to count on unblankin, flipping & putting louiseville back into yr ring. Honestly it's really a waste of time & personally the cost is too high for a ss with low drawing power & becos u are going chain, discard 2 every turn for chain action search via chain trait is already keepin yr hand tiny. Sure goin technical with bbd tb/ icbrtr can help, but cage match shuts u down.
Worst case is the contracting ability tat allows opp to overturn two when hand is 4-, which means hand deduction strategy which is bread & butter of all chain decks is not gonna work thus oso meaning yr impt actions tat counts may nv hit the ring.


Ok, u guys probably won't care what i say/feedback anyway, so yup. Btw lacey win requirements is kind of unattainable since by default u nd at least 38 turns. & most stall decks dun even go 38 turns. #howmanytimesdiduseentherevised12roundsbeenactivated?

Everyone has draw power with Evening up the Odds. And Corny w/ midnight's could also use Parts unknown, With blank grapples and the high risks from ringside are also blank.
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Offline Naitchng

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Re: Virtual Holiday: Then, Now, Forever
« Reply #86 on: January 14, 2020, 11:23:08 PM »
Superstar guide is the correct answer. Image will be updated to reflect this come revisions.

Woah den cornette is even lousier den he already is.
Not perm, can flip, can blank & such a big cost to ace when he has no drawing power🤔.
An ability tat contradicts itself for goin chain & nthin to negate oswm tb🤔. Guess going heat stall is probably the only viable way & just concede when yr opponent plays oswm tb👍

Cornette has been testing by various people playing various ways. There are methods to flip cards back over, unblank it and so on. Lots of decks do poorly against OSWM as well, doesn't mean he is a lousy Superstar.

Lols every thing u said i already knew. I did formed him both aggro & stall, the conclusion is still heat stall is the best without much use of louiseville lips. If u have to count on unblankin, flipping & putting louiseville back into yr ring. Honestly it's really a waste of time & personally the cost is too high for a ss with low drawing power & becos u are going chain, discard 2 every turn for chain action search via chain trait is already keepin yr hand tiny. Sure goin technical with bbd tb/ icbrtr can help, but cage match shuts u down.
Worst case is the contracting ability tat allows opp to overturn two when hand is 4-, which means hand deduction strategy which is bread & butter of all chain decks is not gonna work thus oso meaning yr impt actions tat counts may nv hit the ring.


Ok, u guys probably won't care what i say/feedback anyway, so yup. Btw lacey win requirements is kind of unattainable since by default u nd at least 38 turns. & most stall decks dun even go 38 turns. #howmanytimesdiduseentherevised12roundsbeenactivated?

Everyone has draw power with Evening up the Odds. And Corny w/ midnight's could also use Parts unknown, With blank grapples and the high risks from ringside are also blank.

Haha I am runnin evening the odds btw, most matches still lack hands & almost guaranteed loss to mania.

Offline necrobaron75

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Re: Virtual Holiday: Then, Now, Forever
« Reply #87 on: January 21, 2020, 12:20:34 PM »
Superstar guide is the correct answer. Image will be updated to reflect this come revisions.

Woah den cornette is even lousier den he already is.
Not perm, can flip, can blank & such a big cost to ace when he has no drawing power🤔.
An ability tat contradicts itself for goin chain & nthin to negate oswm tb🤔. Guess going heat stall is probably the only viable way & just concede when yr opponent plays oswm tb👍

Cornette has been testing by various people playing various ways. There are methods to flip cards back over, unblank it and so on. Lots of decks do poorly against OSWM as well, doesn't mean he is a lousy Superstar.

EXACTLY why it needs to be toned down
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Offline darkdestiny91

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Re: Virtual Holiday: Then, Now, Forever
« Reply #88 on: January 28, 2020, 07:28:47 PM »
Superstar guide is the correct answer. Image will be updated to reflect this come revisions.

Woah den cornette is even lousier den he already is.
Not perm, can flip, can blank & such a big cost to ace when he has no drawing power🤔.
An ability tat contradicts itself for goin chain & nthin to negate oswm tb🤔. Guess going heat stall is probably the only viable way & just concede when yr opponent plays oswm tb👍

Cornette has been testing by various people playing various ways. There are methods to flip cards back over, unblank it and so on. Lots of decks do poorly against OSWM as well, doesn't mean he is a lousy Superstar.

EXACTLY why it needs to be toned down

Agree with necrobaron here. We finally get a blue control deck contender that could be good against OSWM TB but when we point it out, your argument is that "other decks suck against OSWM TB too" without providing specific reasoning for why Corny's cards are broken otherwise in your testing, then maybe OSWM TB isn't the problem here.

Offline Eric RD

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Re: Virtual Holiday: Then, Now, Forever
« Reply #89 on: January 30, 2020, 05:01:06 AM »
Superstar guide is the correct answer. Image will be updated to reflect this come revisions.

Woah den cornette is even lousier den he already is.
Not perm, can flip, can blank & such a big cost to ace when he has no drawing power🤔.
An ability tat contradicts itself for goin chain & nthin to negate oswm tb🤔. Guess going heat stall is probably the only viable way & just concede when yr opponent plays oswm tb👍

Cornette has been testing by various people playing various ways. There are methods to flip cards back over, unblank it and so on. Lots of decks do poorly against OSWM as well, doesn't mean he is a lousy Superstar.

EXACTLY why it needs to be toned down

Agree with necrobaron here. We finally get a blue control deck contender that could be good against OSWM TB but when we point it out, your argument is that "other decks suck against OSWM TB too" without providing specific reasoning for why Corny's cards are broken otherwise in your testing, then maybe OSWM TB isn't the problem here.

Revisions are still coming in the first part of the year. We know there are some problematic cards that will be getting adjusted.  I don't belueve we need to reveal everything that comes across in playtesting.

If you feel that OSWM isn't the problem then I would love to hear your thoughts as to what it could be.
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Offline darkdestiny91

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Re: Virtual Holiday: Then, Now, Forever
« Reply #90 on: February 08, 2020, 08:30:47 PM »

Revisions are still coming in the first part of the year. We know there are some problematic cards that will be getting adjusted.  I don't belueve we need to reveal everything that comes across in playtesting.

If you feel that OSWM isn't the problem then I would love to hear your thoughts as to what it could be.

OSWM TB, imo, is needed to balance out the Aggro > Blue Control > Sponge > Aggro dynamic of decks. As OSWM TB hits both Blue Control and Sponge, it is intended so that Aggro can have a decent chance to win against sponge, while it's the only tool they have against Blue Control - right now, there aren't many decks with powerful action reversals that can help Aggro close games in a Blue vs Aggro matchup thus nerfing OSWM TB will inevitably create more problems down the line, such as sponge becoming potentially too dominant or Blue Control swallowing the meta.

What needs to be done is allow Blue Decks some way to combat OSWM TB without nerfing it directly. Torrie and Trish's This IS What We Came To See! card is one of the best ways to deal with OSWM TB. Right now, the angry mob calling for OSWM TB to get hit by the nerf bat is, imo, a kneejerk reaction. Either you learn to play around OSWM TB or you build a better Blue Control deck.

BUT there's also a need for the development/playtest team to allow superstars to have special ways to circumvent OSWM TB, in this case, Cornette, when they're designed around action cards.