Author Topic: Question on Fortitude Surge effect  (Read 617 times)

Offline incognito

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Question on Fortitude Surge effect
« on: February 25, 2018, 02:29:26 AM »
Hi. From what I understand, F.S can be played whenever my opponent is modifying my reversal cards (fortitude and/or damage) to his cards. My question is, can I activate the F.S effect on the same turn I play the card?

For example:

Opponent plays "You Cant Spell Furniture Without F-U-N"
I play "Fortitude Surge" - goes to my Ring Area
Opponent plays "Chair Shot"
I remove F.S from my Ring Area to Ringside Pile and my reversals to his Chair Shot is unaffected.

Is this the right scenario?

Also, lets say if my opponent plays Bionic Elbow, can I play Fortitude Surge and then immediately remove it from my Ring Area to Ringside Pile so that I can reverse the maneuver as per normal? Since F.S does not reverse the Bionic Elbow, is F.S affected by the Fortitude modification by Bionic Elbow?

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Re: Question on Fortitude Surge effect
« Reply #1 on: February 25, 2018, 04:06:29 AM »
#129/643 Fortitude Surge (SS2)
Mid-match Reversal: Special
Can only be played when your opponent is modifying your Reversal cards.
When this card is in your Ring area, you may put this card into your Ringside pile and your Reversal cards are unaffected by Fortitude modification for the rest of the turn. 
   (Activated Card Effect Symbol)  
F: 0      D: 0
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Offline incognito

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Re: Question on Fortitude Surge effect
« Reply #2 on: February 25, 2018, 08:05:09 AM »
So can it be played after my opponent plays cards like Bionic Elbow?

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Re: Question on Fortitude Surge effect
« Reply #3 on: February 25, 2018, 09:10:45 AM »
I was just providing the text. It's easier to give you a response when you post the text of the card.
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Offline Mitch!

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Re: Question on Fortitude Surge effect
« Reply #4 on: February 25, 2018, 09:10:49 AM »
Bionic elbow is called a "self plunging" effect which leaves you no time to play fortitude surge as listed in the omni-faq:

Bionic Elbow
-If played by Bubba Ray Dudley, the +10F to your opponent’s reversals takes place immediately, and will affect cards such as Fortitude Surge.  This is known as a “self-plunging” effect.
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Offline DebuRaito

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Re: Question on Fortitude Surge effect
« Reply #5 on: February 25, 2018, 09:41:58 AM »
Another follow up qns:

If Buh-Buh's opponent has 10F but he only has Manager Interferes in hand, can he play fort surge, ace it and play MI? Since I'm not sure if a player is able to play 2 reversals to a single maneuver.

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Re: Question on Fortitude Surge effect
« Reply #6 on: February 25, 2018, 09:57:00 AM »
Yes because Surge isn't reversing anything, long as you have the fortitude it can be used.
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Offline CRASHER

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Re: Question on Fortitude Surge effect
« Reply #7 on: February 25, 2018, 10:02:10 AM »
also remember you can also drop surge on something POSITIVELY modifying your reversals, like the "reversals to this are +2D" on running lariat

that used to be the way you survived the Plunger-taker back in the day.....
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Offline DebuRaito

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Re: Question on Fortitude Surge effect
« Reply #8 on: February 25, 2018, 10:51:57 AM »
Yes because Surge isn't reversing anything, long as you have the fortitude it can be used.

But we are still playing reversal to the Bionic Elbow right? (in spite of not reversing it)

Isn't that the reason why Restricted Use in this Area has the "you may still play reversals to that card" text?

Restricted Use in This Area
Mid-match Reversal: Special
Can only be played after your opponent plays a card that he has modified by other cards.
Disregard all modifications made to that card by other cards until the end of the turn.
You may still play Reversal cards to that card.

Unless the ruling is that Fortitude Surge is not played against Bionic Elbow, but against the fortitude modifications, although I am still not really sure about that.

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Re: Question on Fortitude Surge effect
« Reply #9 on: February 25, 2018, 11:07:03 AM »
Fort Surge also doesn't say it's actually reversing anything when you play it, so in the "weird wording game" that is Raw Deal it doesn't count as a played reversal :)
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Offline DebuRaito

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Re: Question on Fortitude Surge effect
« Reply #10 on: February 25, 2018, 11:47:23 AM »
Fort Surge also doesn't say it's actually reversing anything when you play it, so in the "weird wording game" that is Raw Deal it doesn't count as a played reversal :)

For this, I am sure it is definitely a played reversal. I am just unsure if it already took up the respond slot against Bionic Elbow.

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Re: Question on Fortitude Surge effect
« Reply #11 on: February 25, 2018, 02:34:59 PM »
Mitch is wrong. Fortitude Surge would take up your one response to the card. While Fortitude Surge is weird, and is played in response to a condition and not necessarily a card, that doesn't get around the rule that you can only respond once during a particular card's Timing Sequence unless something (the Multi rule, the text of Restricted Use in This Area, etc.) explicitly permits you another response. If I throw Bionic Elbow and trigger the self-plunge, you cannot play Fortitude Surge, pop Fortitude Surge, and then immediately play Manager Interferes, as that's one too many responses to the card.

What WOULD be legal, though, is to play Fortitude Surge (assuming that you had the 10F), immediately pop it, and then use that effect to enable reversing from Arsenal without being worried about the plunge.
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Re: Question on Fortitude Surge effect
« Reply #12 on: February 26, 2018, 05:04:00 AM »
Mitch is wrong. Fortitude Surge would take up your one response to the card. While Fortitude Surge is weird, and is played in response to a condition and not necessarily a card, that doesn't get around the rule that you can only respond once during a particular card's Timing Sequence unless something (the Multi rule, the text of Restricted Use in This Area, etc.) explicitly permits you another response. If I throw Bionic Elbow and trigger the self-plunge, you cannot play Fortitude Surge, pop Fortitude Surge, and then immediately play Manager Interferes, as that's one too many responses to the card.

What WOULD be legal, though, is to play Fortitude Surge (assuming that you had the 10F), immediately pop it, and then use that effect to enable reversing from Arsenal without being worried about the plunge.

Thanks for your response. So, to summarise what you and others have explained, Fort Surge cannot be played AND then trigger the ACE effect in response to one card your opponent plays?

So once he plays Bionic Elbow, I have to have at least 10F to play Fort Surge but I won't be able to activate the effect OR I can activate the effect and reverse it as usual if Fort Surge was already in my ring area. Am I right to say the above?

Thanks.

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Re: Question on Fortitude Surge effect
« Reply #13 on: February 26, 2018, 12:42:04 PM »
Playing Fortitude Surge and then immediately triggering the ACE is fine.

Playing Fortitude Surge and then playing another card in response to the same card is not, for the same reason why you can't play two Elbow to the Face cards to a Headlock Takedown. Whether you use the ACE on Fortitude Surge to play the other card or not is inconsequential.
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Re: Question on Fortitude Surge effect
« Reply #14 on: February 28, 2018, 09:17:58 AM »
Playing Fortitude Surge and then immediately triggering the ACE is fine.

Playing Fortitude Surge and then playing another card in response to the same card is not, for the same reason why you can't play two Elbow to the Face cards to a Headlock Takedown. Whether you use the ACE on Fortitude Surge to play the other card or not is inconsequential.

Okay. So if my opponent plays Bionic Elbow, I can play Fort Surge (even when my F:0) which then I put it from my Ring Area to Ringside Pile to activate the effect. By doing so I cannot play anymore reversals from my hand/backlash deck and I can only reverse it from the Arsenal?

Am I right?

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Re: Question on Fortitude Surge effect
« Reply #15 on: February 28, 2018, 09:22:47 AM »
Playing Fortitude Surge and then immediately triggering the ACE is fine.

Playing Fortitude Surge and then playing another card in response to the same card is not, for the same reason why you can't play two Elbow to the Face cards to a Headlock Takedown. Whether you use the ACE on Fortitude Surge to play the other card or not is inconsequential.

Okay. So if my opponent plays Bionic Elbow, I can play Fort Surge (even when my F:0) which then I put it from my Ring Area to Ringside Pile to activate the effect. By doing so I cannot play anymore reversals from my hand/backlash deck and I can only reverse it from the Arsenal?

Am I right?

The parenthetical reference is incorrect; the remainder of your analysis is. Bionic Elbow's +10F applies to any red card played against it, and applies before Fort Surge can be attempted; you would need to have 10F to play the Surge itself.

Presuming you did have the 10F, you could then play the Fortitude Surge. This locks you out of playing another reversal card from hand, backlash, or Ringside to the Bionic Elbow, and the Elbow is successfully played.

If you choose to pop Fort Surge at that point, your reversals from Arsenal would be protected from the plunge.

If you choose not to pop Fort Surge, your reversals from Arsenal would be +10F.
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Re: Question on Fortitude Surge effect
« Reply #16 on: February 28, 2018, 08:11:58 PM »
dilbert's rundown is 100% accurate.
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Re: Question on Fortitude Surge effect
« Reply #17 on: March 01, 2018, 04:41:56 AM »
A big thank you to everyone with the responses.