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Messages - dilbert505

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1
Rules Forum / Re: <R> Powerful Resistance
« on: September 18, 2018, 10:36:45 AM »
If it doesn't say "reverse," it doesn't reverse, but it is still a response to the played card. As you only get one response to a played card (usually), if that response is an effect that doesn't reverse, the card is successful.

(It's worth bearing in mind that Revolution card templating differs from Classic card templating, in that Revo cards try to cut extraneous words wherever possible, to a greater degree than Classic cards. The absence of specific terminology you might have otherwise seen on a Classic card doesn't necessarily mean the card works differently; it just means that the card was worded differently to save space.)

2
General Discussion: Raw Deal / Re: Is there a list of formats?
« on: September 09, 2018, 09:57:18 AM »
Dilbert, this is really well written. Would you mind if I posted this on the RawDealSG facebook page as a screenshot? It gives players a good overview of the available formats for them to choose from. Virtual seems like the most difficult to explain because most players (including myself), thought that virtual really just meant cards that are digital, instead of something that can be printed.

Feel free! I've edited the post to highlight the names of the formats; when I got back to look at it again, I realized it would be helpful to have the names pop out a bit.

Excellent! Thank you very much!

Is NXT used a lot? It seems like a headache to construct with all the restrictions.

NXT isn't played to the same extent as Virtual Classic or Virtual Revolution (the two most popular formats, by a lot), but IMO, it should be. NXT is my favorite format, hands down, because the limitations on Pre-match let you get playing much faster, and the banned list really just reflects the unofficial banned list on the Shenanigans cards. (plus a very select few cards that are abusive in a limited pre-match format, like San Diego, California.) It plays like a faster version of Virtual Classic, and is pretty well balanced, on the whole. I just wish it got more play in my local area.

Virtual Classic is the predominant format, though, and since it's close enough to NXT format, I don't mind so much.  :D

3
General Discussion: Raw Deal / Re: Is there a list of formats?
« on: September 09, 2018, 08:06:42 AM »
In brief: (6 of these are simple, two are less so)

Classic - Any card printed by Comic Images without the Revolution logo. You may pack 10 Pre-Match cards and 10 Mid-Match cards in your Backlash deck, and you have 5 slots to play each type during the game. (This can be modified by cards or abilities.) Pre-Match stages are Venue, Feud, Stipulation, Manager, then everything else. Hand draw happens after Pre-Match cards are played, but before they are resolved.

Virtual Classic - Any card, either printed by Comic Images or created by the RDPC, without the Revolution logo. You may pack 12 Pre-Match cards and 12 Mid-Match cards in your Backlash deck, and you have 6 slots to play each type during the game. (This can be modified by cards or abilities.) The additional capacity is due to the introduction of an additional Pre-Match card type, the Allegiance, which is played before the Venue.


Revolution - Any card printed by Comic Images with the Revolution logo.
Virtual Revolution - Any card, either printed by Comic Images or created by the RDPC, with the Revolution logo. For both of these formats, you may pack 6 Pre-Match and 6 Mid-Match cards, and have 3 play slots available. For both of these formats, hand draw happens before any Pre-Match cards are played.


All-Axxess - Any card printed by Comic Images. Build/pack/play rules are the same as Classic.
Virtual All-Axxess - Any card, either printed by Comic Images or created by the RDPC. Build/pack/play rules are the same as Virtual Classic.

NXT - This is a modified version of Virtual Classic. There is a specific card, the "NXT Rules" card, that includes a Banned List of cards that may not be packed, a list of cards that have Errata specifically for the format (these errata cards are all available on this site, and all say "NXT Format" on them; they are only to be used in that format), and a list of Backstage cards that may be packed; all other Backstage cards that are not Superstar-specific are banned. For this format, you may pack 8 Pre-Match and 8 Mid-Match cards, and have 4 play slots available for each.

Tornado tag (unofficial format) - http://teamcanadaonline.net///index.php/topic,2168.0.html - This one I can't summarize neatly enough, so I'm just pasting the link to the rules document here. The super short version is that it's a Classic format where you pack Superstar-specific cards for two superstars in a single deck; either superstar's cards are legal, and both abilities affect the game at the same time. There are banned lists of superstars, and specific combinations that are not permitted because they're abusive, but the rules explain that.

There is one other format, Afterburn, which is a limited version of Classic that only permits a subset of Comic Images-printed Classic cards, but to the best of my knowledge, that isn't played anymore, and I don't know the list of banned cards off the top of my head, so I wouldn't want to mislead you on that.

There's also Tag Team, but the rules are a mess and it requires 4 players in teams of two, building decks in concert. I don't recommend it.

4
Rules Forum / Re: Blanking card moved from ring and then re-played
« on: September 06, 2018, 12:25:45 PM »
1) When a card is blanked by an opponent's effect, only that specific instance of the card is blank, unless the blanking effect is worded "your opponent's cards named "NAME OF CARD" are blank." If he blanks your Kick, your other Kick is perfectly normal.

2) Once the card leaves your Ring, for any reason, to any location, the Rest Hold essentially forgets that it was ever there. It would not be blank when you play it again. (IIRC, the reason for this is that the game has no way of tracking the card through non-public locations; once it ends up back in your Arsenal or Hand, your opponent cannot know that you're telling the truth when you say that's the same copy of the card, so the rules forcibly terminate the effect to ensure that it doesn't have to be tracked at all.)

5
Rules Forum / Re: Lantern
« on: August 22, 2018, 01:03:03 PM »
Timing Breakdown, step 2a.

Quote
2a Determine the Fortitude cost for the card, including modifiers, the effects of the card’s player first, then his opponent’s effects. (Multiplication/division first, then addition/subtraction.) You may not play a card if you cannot meet the Fortitude cost, unless a ‘when played’ effect can lower the Fortitude cost; this effect can only be as a function of playing the card.

Batista reduces his Spinebuster to 0 first; by the time the Lantern gets a look at it, it sees an F:0 card and does nothing to it.

Same principle applies against Doink.

6
Correct. The entirety of the card text is replaced with those three words in all zones; when the text is changed, all the card does is reverse any card.

7
General Discussion: Raw Deal / Re: Virtual All Axxess, do you play it?
« on: August 10, 2018, 06:02:02 AM »
I wish I could vote no AND no fun, but I voted just no :)

QFT.

8
Well Gen Con is here so now the question is how soon till we see these cards
:D

The answer is, as always, "When it's ready."

9
Rules Forum / Re: Intellectual Savior
« on: July 30, 2018, 12:12:56 PM »
OK, let's start with the card being successful. It's his card going through the timing breakdown, so you are the opponent in this process.

Quote from: Timing Breakdown
6 The card is now 'Successfully Played' and enters the Ring Area.  If this card is reversing the card in question (it is not the first reversal to a Multi, it is not Over Sell Maneuver), the affected maneuver is now considered reversed. (Any text on the card and any Traits on the card are considered to be in your Ring Area after this step is complete. This excludes text that would modify or trigger in any of the first six steps.)
6a Some cards are put into the Ringside Pile or other area instead of going to the Ring Area (Iron Will etc.) The Timing Breakdown still continues as normal, these cards never enter the Ring Area.  They will resolve during the text resolution (Step 8) at that time, and will still resolve to its destination even if blanked.

7a Effects you control (other than this card's text taking place when played or when successful played) that trigger on a Successfully Played card take place. In the event of more than one effect, you choose which order they occur.
7b Effects your opponent controls that trigger on a Successfully Played card take place. Opponent chooses the order. (This is where cards such as Over Sell Maneuver and Sustained Damage are played.)

8 Apply effects listed on the card, unless these effects take place ‘when played’ or ‘when this card is in’ a specified area.

9a Chance for activated damage modification (Sustained Damage, Los Guerreros)
9b Damage is overturned one card at a time. Appropriate reversals may be overturned.  (This is also the Step where cards are overturned for Raw & Ready, Over Sell Maneuver, and other cards that replace damage with overturning cards.)
9c Effects generated from resolving a maneuver’s damage may be performed by the player of the original card (searching for a Chain card, for example)
9d Effects generated from resolving a maneuver’s damage may be performed by the opponent (Jamie Noble’s superstar ability, activating There’s No Holding Me Back)
9e Any ‘end the turn’ effects are resolved, along with any effects triggered by ending the turn.

Intellectual Savior is an outside effect controlled by the opponent, triggered on a successfully played card. It goes off in 7b, then the card text triggers in step 8.

10
Fantasy Cards / Re: Elias
« on: July 27, 2018, 11:59:50 AM »
Yeah, as Creed is implying, Let's Get It On is non-unique, so more needs to be done there.

My idea for a fix would have been "Your opponent reveals his backlash deck and you may put any non-Superstar Specific non-reversal card into his ring; it is blank." That way, you get any one card, but no Restricted Use monkeyshines, and you wouldn't be able to use it to end their Pre-Match preemptively.

(Alternate solution, but this would require a new keyword in the game: "Your opponent reveals his backlash deck and you may put any valid non-Reversal into his ring face-down." Valid would be a keyword that means "any card that can fulfill this criterion," so since we're talking face down, it would be any non-Permanent, non-RMS, non-Active card, with "non-Reversal" being an additional limitation.)

11
Rules Forum / Re: Overshot
« on: July 23, 2018, 12:54:38 PM »
I'll answer your question with another card.

Backed by Smackdown GM Vickie Guerrero
Pre-match Event
Cannot be packed when packing Enforcers or by a Legend, or by Chris Benoit, Eddie Guerrero, Latino Cheat, Rey Mysterio, Shane O'Mac, or The People's Champ.
Your opponent cannot play non-Superstar-specific non-D:0 reversals (except Manager Interferes) or Overshot Your Mark to your first non-Superstar-specific Smackdown non-F:0 maneuver played each turn.
Your next Pre-match Smackdown card played gains the text "Your Pre-match Capacity is +1."
F: 0     D: 0     Unique     Smackdown logo

If Overshot Your Mark was a non-D:0 reversal when played, it would not need to be explicitly referenced on this card, since non-D:0 reversals are already covered by the first clause.

tl;dr - Overshot is D:0 when played.

12
General Discussion: Raw Deal / Re: Quick opinion poll
« on: July 20, 2018, 07:11:49 AM »
It absolutely is problematic. Not so big a deal if the card is exceptionally situational, but when you're talking something as mission-critical as Divine Intervention, you almost have to plunk down the cash. Optimally, prizes should be full art/alternate art of cards that already exist, or non-card prizes. If a developer wants to release unique cards as prizes, the only really safe way to do it is to release alternate art of cards that will be in the immediately upcoming set; that way, players who win get the advantage of playing with upcoming cards a couple months early, people who desperately want those cards can try to win or buy them, but everyone else need only wait a couple months before the cards see release, and the prices go down.

13
Deck Reviews - Classic / Re: TB Hulk Hogan
« on: July 15, 2018, 11:44:33 AM »
To clarify (since I'm not sure everyone noticed that this was posted in the Classic forum): In classic, this deck works just fine.

In Virtual Classic, the card in question is blank.

Enough Shenanigans!
Backstage Card
All players' Calling You Out, Inferno Match Stipulation, It's All About the Game, Piper's Pit, non-Throwback Premiere WWF Superstar, Premiere WWE Superstar, Run the Gauntlet, Yo! Kill da Beat!, Revolution Judgment Day cards are blank.
When he is Ken Kennedy or JBL, his Ability is blank.
When he is Rowdy Roddy Piper, his Ability reads "During your opponent's turns, when he plays a non-Superstar-specific card with 'reverse' in the text, he discards 1 card."
Unique     RMS logo

14
Rules Forum / Re: Clarification
« on: July 11, 2018, 12:00:43 PM »
The Lion's Den Match
Pre-match Stipulation
Cannot be blanked.
Non-Unique non-Superstar-specific non-maneuver cards and card effects from non-Unique non-Superstar-specific non-Stipulation cards (except Volley This!) cannot move cards from any Ringside.
When you successfully play a maneuver, shuffle up to 1 maneuver from Ringside into your Arsenal.
F: 0     D: 0     Unique     Permanent

Does this mean Unique Superstar specific OR Unique or superstar specific?

Example, can My Name Is... shuffle cards in because it's superstar specific? or not because it is non-unique.

Cards that are Unique, OR cards that are Superstar-Specific, OR cards that are maneuvers, may move cards from Ringside. (Also, card effects from Unique cards, Superstar-Specific cards, Stipulation cards, and Volley This may move cards from Ringside.)

An example for each category:

Here Comes the Cavalry: Unique. May move cards.
My Name Is: Superstar specific. May move cards.
Quick Snap Suplex: Maneuver. May move cards.
Not In Front Of the Kids: Not unique, not Superstar Specific, not a maneuver. May not move cards.

ACE on Proper Planning Prevents Piss Poor Performance: Effect from a unique card. May move cards.
ACE on Proper Planning Prevents Piss Poor Performance: Effect from a Superstar-specific card. May move cards.
ACE on Chicago Street Fight: Effect from a Stipulation. May move cards.
ACE on JR Style Clubberin: not unique, not superstar specific, not a Stipulation. May not move cards.

15
Did we scrap NXT for this worlds

Not so much "scrapped" as "it was never an official format for Worlds." There was discussion around the subject, but that was all unofficial stuff, and didn't amount to anything.

16
Rants Forum / Re: Enzo Amoré is Innocent!
« on: July 01, 2018, 07:30:26 PM »
So I fail to see how some "allegations" against Enzo disqualifies him from being part of Raw Deal?

The dev team has no interest in developing him. That's all the disqualification required.

17
Rules Forum / Re: "Successfully play"
« on: June 30, 2018, 06:13:01 PM »
Yes. The rulebook, as written, explains the most common scenario, but does not cover all contingencies. Exceptions to a rule do not unmake the rule; they provide exceptions.

The timing breakdown clarifies this.

Quote from: Timing Breakdown
6a) Some cards are put into the Ringside Pile or other area instead of going to the Ring Area (Iron Will etc.) The Timing Breakdown still continues as normal, these cards never enter the Ring Area.  They will resolve during the text resolution ( Step 8 ) at that time, and will still resolve to its destination even if blanked.

18
Rules Forum / Re: Here Comes the Calvary qns
« on: June 28, 2018, 03:36:52 PM »
That depends on whether or not they pack The Numbers Game. If they forgo Numbers Game, they may pack Cavalry. If they pack Numbers Game, they are a Stable, and cannot pack Cavalry.

19
General Chat / Re: The most heated debate ever
« on: June 27, 2018, 09:36:38 AM »
A hot dog is clearly a sausage inna bun.

(Now let's see how many Discworld fans we have here.)

20
Rules Forum / Re: Absolute Power Corruots Absolutely
« on: June 27, 2018, 07:15:15 AM »
All hail King Timing Breakdown I.

1 Play the card.  Until the card is moved to another area, it is not in any area while resolving the Timing Breakdown.
1a Reveal the card to all players and choose a target or targets for the card (if any.)

2a Determine the Fortitude cost for the card, including modifiers, the effects of the card’s player first, then his opponent’s effects. (Multiplication/division first, then addition/subtraction.) You may not play a card if you cannot meet the Fortitude cost, unless a ‘when played’ effect can lower the Fortitude cost; this effect can only be as a function of playing the card.
2b Determine that you can meet all of the 'must' requirements listed on the card.
2c Check that a Follow-up condition is met (if required), including any ‘ignore the text’ effects.
2d If any of these steps can not be satisfied, the sequence ends immediately and the card remains where it started. (It does not count as having been played.)
2e Apply any ‘when played’ effects from the card’s controller.
2f Apply any ‘when played’ effects from the opponent.

If you cannot pass the "Can only be played" effect by step 2B, the card leaves the timing breakdown in step 2D, before you get to apply the When Played effect in step 2E.

21
Fantasy Cards / Re: Fantasy support cards
« on: June 26, 2018, 10:01:01 AM »
Lol rusev day man thats way to good. No way that would pass playtesting.

What do you suggest should be done to make it less way to good?
Maybe they discard a card for a non-Chain maneuver instead of any maneuver.

It needs to be limited to a single use. If you can find a way to fit it, add the line "If this card is moved from your Ring by your effects or turned face up, put it in your Ring face down." That way, it can't come back into play.

The idea is it can come back into play. You're not going to be able to flip it back over until you get Turning Everything Upside Down into play. So you get the one shot and wait it until until you're F:6 and lower Fortitude, or as a reversal.

That idea is why it's way too good. Let's take all of Rusev's cards off the table except Bulgarian Brute and Happy Rusev Day (and Turning Everything Upside Down) for a second.


The Bulgarian Brute
Backstage Card
When you do not have 10+ greater Fortitude and your printed D: 5+ non-Multi maneuver is completely reversed from Arsenal during the first 3 cards while applying damage, before you would draw for Stun Value you may discard 2 cards; your maneuver is not reversed, he puts his reversal on the bottom of his Arsenal and continues to apply damage, he may reverse from Arsenal again as normal, and after all damage is applied end your turn.
Unique     RMS logo
VHS2

For the sake of argument, let's say Rusev is less than 10F ahead of his opponent. Rusev throws a Precision Kick, so hand only.

First, they attempt to reverse it from hand. That's one reversal gone.

Then, Happy Rusev Day. That's another card out of his hand.

Turning Everything Upside Down flips Happy Rusev Day.

Throw the Precision Kick again.

It gets reversed a second time.

Happy Rusev Day again, so now he's down 2 reversals and 2 other cards to your 1 Precision Kick, which of course you throw again.

Say it goes through on attempt 3.

Then they overturn a reversal in the top 3 cards.

Then you discard 2 to bottom his overturned reversal, and he keeps eating damage.

Then on your next turn, flip Happy Rusev Day up again, and we get to do that nonsense twice more with a new card.

--

tl;dr: I would ABSOLUTELY turtle with Rusev to get Turning Everything Upside Down into play, because once this thing gets to the lather, rinse, repeat stage, he's an NPE. (Just imagine how much worse this all would be before the Bulgarian Brute revision.)


---

Edit: If you're adamant about wanting this thing to be usable more than once, it has to have a more elaborate trigger than face down/face up. If it goes to the Backstage to take effect, and comes back to the Ring when you're #F behind your opponent, or something like that, I could see it being more balanced.

22
Fantasy Cards / Re: Fantasy support cards
« on: June 26, 2018, 06:24:17 AM »
Lol rusev day man thats way to good. No way that would pass playtesting.

What do you suggest should be done to make it less way to good?
Maybe they discard a card for a non-Chain maneuver instead of any maneuver.

It needs to be limited to a single use. If you can find a way to fit it, add the line "If this card is moved from your Ring by your effects or turned face up, put it in your Ring face down." That way, it can't come back into play.

23
Oh, thanks for the response. So just to make sure I got this right. If I was playing as Andre the Giant, I can only pack prematch and midmatch cards with the Andre logo correct? I wouldn't be able to pack Managed by Bobby the Brain Heenan with Andre, or does the "can only be packed by a legend" language allow this?

Correct. The game rule in question only applies to cards with a Superstar logo on them. Giant Eiffel Tower, The Heenan Family, The Heenan Family Enforcer, and Giant Choke Hold all have Andre's logo on them, and as a result, he may pack those specific cards.

(In Virtual All Axxess, he may also pack <R> The 8th Wonder of the World and <R> Obey, which also have his logo, and the <R> factions, which have superstar logos and specific text permitting any superstar to pack them.)

Managed by Bobby the Brain does not have a superstar logo printed on it, and as such, Andre's ability takes precedence, and he may not pack it.

8th Wonder may pack any Andre the Giant cards, except for We Face Each Other as God Intended, the Arsenal card titled The 8th Wonder of the World (as it is unique, and shares a card title with the superstar card), and any superstar-specifics that explicitly say "Can only be packed by Andre the Giant." As 8th Wonder does not have a general limitation on packing pre-match cards, he may pack Managed by Bobby the Brain.

24
The thing you are missing is a game rule that overrides Andre's ability.

Quote from: OmniFAQ
-A card with a Superstar logo can be packed and played by a Superstar that can legally pack it, regardless of restrictions from the Ability.

This text means that Andre may pack Giant Eiffel Tower and The Heenan Family, despite his ability saying that he otherwise can't. Also, since the Revolution Faction cards say "You may pack this card regardless of Superstar," those specific Pre-Match cards may be packed by Andre in any format in which they are legal.

The "Can only be packed by Andre the Giant" text on Heenan Family Enforcer forbids 8th Wonder from packing it; he would otherwise be permitted to do so by the Andre logo.

Giant Eiffel Tower does not permit 8th Wonder to pack We Face Each Other as God Intended. That effect can only be triggered against Andre the Giant, who, as I mentioned before, may pack G.E.T. because it is a Superstar-specfic card he is legally entitled to pack.

25
Rules Forum / Re: Ezekiel jackson
« on: June 12, 2018, 08:17:37 AM »
Rio's right. The Pre-Match goes, in order:

Allegiance
Venue
Feud
Stip
Manager
Everything Else
Draw Starting Hands
Resolve "At End of Pre-Match" effects

Then you get into the "after all pre-match phases" and "before the first draw segment" effects, but they're explicitly after the Pre-Match ends.

A common card that can serve as a good reminder of this:

Dynamically Inclined
Backstage Card
Cannot be packed by Doink.
Before starting hands are drawn, search your Arsenal and Ringside for 10 non-Trademark-Finisher maneuvers with "dynamic" in the title, put them under this card, and shuffle;  if you do not, hide this card.  At the end of the Pre-match Phase, choose 1 card under this card, put it into your hand, and shuffle the other cards into your Arsenal.
Your Pre-match Capacity is +1 for each The Luck of The Draw card in your Ring greater than 1.
Your non-Unique maneuvers with "dynamic" in the title are -3F and +2D.
When you have lower Fortitude, your opponent is considered to have double the number of reversals in his Ring for your effects with "dynamic" in the title or text.
Unique     RMS logo

This card would make no sense if starting hands were not drawn until the end of the Pre-Match Phase; the effects would trigger at the same time.

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